By electricks (202.138.36.44) on Wednesday, December 26, 2001 - 11:22 am:

my 1200 is making a knocking noise when the steering wheel is rocked. it sounds to be coming directly from the steering rack, but i replaced that with another that i'm sure was fine... and noice is exactly the same. is there any adjustments on the rack? is this a common problem? any help appreciated.

By Anomalous (24.70.95.203) on Wednesday, December 26, 2001 - 11:31 am:

It may be the universal joint that conects the steering shaft to the steering rack.Yes,this is a common problem.

By ddechon (12.91.132.233) on Wednesday, December 26, 2001 - 01:10 pm:

Try to have a friend move the wheel why you listen carefully. If you hear it you might be able to see it move too. Watch or feel the ball joints for sudden movements. Maybe you could disconnect one side and listen again.

Darrell

By Eric (208.60.186.116) on Wednesday, December 26, 2001 - 09:21 pm:

Hi all

I looked at majestic honda, they only offer the complete shaft (labeled shaft B) and it was almost $300 usd. I saw an individual steering shaft U joint in the summit racing catalog for about 30 bucks, so do you have to replace the complete shaft, or can you just replace the U joints individually..........Thanks all, Eric.....

By John S. (207.160.161.161) on Thursday, December 27, 2001 - 02:35 pm:

Check your inner tierods, one of them is probably worn out.

By dennis singley (65.101.1.51) on Saturday, December 29, 2001 - 06:47 am:

I had to replace the u-joint on my '80 Civic. You can put your left hand on the joint & rock the wheel with your right & feel if there is any play. It made a BIG difference in steering. dennis

By ddechon (12.91.130.215) on Saturday, December 29, 2001 - 11:59 am:

I've been wondering the same thing as Eric. I'm going to tow my honda cross-country next year without the transmission so I'll need something to hold the wheel to the hub. I was thinking of using new u joints to hold it. Then later I would attach the u joint to the shaft since my old ones are worn out.

I once took apart a u-joint in my honda, but I don't remember how the joint was constructed. It wasn't too hard, but good snap-ring pliers are needed. It was frustrating trying to work with slipery grease.

Darrell

By Eric (208.60.186.89) on Saturday, December 29, 2001 - 12:18 pm:

Hey Darrell

I wasn't talking about the U-joints in the C.V. axles, I was talking about the ones at the bottom of the steering collumn where it goes into the rack. There are 2 U joints there that look sort of like the U-joints on the driveshaft of a rear wheel drive car but they're a lot smaller. I think it would be easier to replace these individually than to buy the shaft complete from Honda. As for your situation, I think you could talk a C.V. axle apart and use just the outer section with the big bolt and axle nut as a "nut and bolt" thorugh the spindle and hub to hold the wheel to the hub as you tow your car. Talk to you later.......Eric

By ddechon (12.91.130.215) on Saturday, December 29, 2001 - 12:55 pm:

Ha!
Ohhhh yeah.
I just love sounding like idiot.

Thanks!

By Eric (208.60.186.129) on Saturday, December 29, 2001 - 05:33 pm:

Hey again Darrel

It's ok......it's my fault for not being more specific. I hope you can get it towed.....the electric car idea sounds cool.

By electricks (203.62.158.1) on Sunday, December 30, 2001 - 04:37 pm:

thanks for help so far,
two questions
what is a tie rod, exactly (if it's what i thought it was then i didn't think it would make a difference, or wear out for that matter, just bend when you hit things)?

and if its the 'universal joint that conects the steering shaft to the steering rack' then how is this fixed/replaced?

i'm actually 550k's away from my car at the moment, so i will be relaying help to my dad (he probably knows what a tie rod is, but i'll ask anyway).

By Adrian (Civicguru) (165.228.11.61) on Sunday, December 30, 2001 - 05:33 pm:

The tie rod is the rod that connect the end of the steering rack to the upright. There is a ball joint at each end. Technically you are correct - the actual tie rod won't wear out and is quite likely to bend if you hit something, but the ball joints do wear out. The inner balljoint is part of the tie rod so that's why people usually just say the tie rod wears out but in actual fact it's the "tie rod inner ball joint" . Knocking noises in the steering are usually, as has been stated, the universal joints (there are two of them) at the bottom of the steering rack and/or the inner tie rod balljoints. The tie rod ends (outer balljoints) wear out fairly often but they don't usually produce clunks that feel like they are in the rack. The racks themselves don't wear out very often (especially if you keep them greased (the ONE thing on the car that actually has a grease nipple!)). There is usually a tiny bit of play in the rack but it's nothing to worry about and shouldn't clunk at all.
The best way to check the universal joints is to simply look at them and feel them. watch them very closely as you rock the wheel back and forth. Also put your hands over them as you rock the wheel and feel for movement.
I've found very very few good ones from EB Civics. Currently I'm using one from an EN Civic which fits with some minor mods and is nice and tight.
To check the balljoints; jack up the front of the car and move the wheels back and forth. You'll see excess play immediately.


ddechon: You don't need a CV joint in the hub to hold the wheel on. The hub is a press fit into the bearings and the wheel is bolted to the hub so unless your bearings are worn you shouldn't even have any excess movement without a CV joint in there ... you're just trying to make work for yourself!

By ddechon (12.91.130.47) on Monday, December 31, 2001 - 06:04 am:

Thanks Adrian.

I checked out the manual for the first time in about a year. I'd still like to put something in there to secure it. When I tow it, I'll be using a tow bar, so all four wheels will be on the ground. In case the fitting comes loose, I'd like to have the bolt to rely on. I'd also like to put something in there so no dirt will get into the bearings. I feel better about the situation though. Thanks

I was looking at the rack and pinion in the manual. It said you can adjust the steering rack pressure until the play is taken out. If you have steering wheel play you should check the following...

1) Steering Shaft U-Joints
2) Rack Guide adjustment
3) Tie-rod ball joints inboard and outboard
4) Lower suspension arm ball joint

Here's how you check steering rack play...

Raise the car on jack stands. Undo the rack boot restraining the bands at the pinion end of the rack housing and move the boot down the tie-rod to expose the rack. Grasp the rack and attempt to move it up, and down, and to and fro. Check for movement when the steering is set fully-righ, mid-right, straight-ahead, mid-left and finally full-left. If any radial movement is detected proceed to adjusted the steering rack block pressure.

If you guys want the details for the rack adjustment let me know.

You can't adjusted the rack to make up for a bad joint, but it should be checked too. I thought the rack adjustment was pretty cool.

Ya learn something everyday.
Darrell

By Adrian (Civicguru) (165.228.11.61) on Monday, December 31, 2001 - 02:20 pm:

EN1 steering shaft uni-joints into an EB: Had a quick check in the car and it looks like I didn't have to do any mods to make it fit after all. There is a splined slip joint between the two uni-joints which you have to slide in as far as it will go and that's all there is to it.

ddechon: Sorry, but are you insane?? You said you're going to tow your car "cross-country", which I take to mean some reasonable distance, and you're going to flat-tow it??????? You yanks must be crazier than I thought!
Mate, get yourself a car trailer and do it properly so you don't kill yourself...

By ddechon (12.91.130.201) on Monday, December 31, 2001 - 02:57 pm:

Yes! Me Yanks be crazy. Me wife likes it when me yank yanks the yanker. She be sayin shiiii. Me say sho nuf. You dig?

Considering I brought the car here by driving it into a Ryder truck, yes I am crazy. Then I drove the truck while towing my other car. No not a low riding u-haul, but high Ryder truck. I drove the truck from CA to MD. Why? Just to save a buck. That was crazy!

Why do you think I'm crazy for towing with a tow bar? Are you tow bar challenged? Tow bars are used all the time.

Thanks for laugh. Just having fun ya yanks.
Darrell

By Don (209.181.52.64) on Monday, December 31, 2001 - 04:36 pm:

At least use a tow dolly. Then again if your pulling it with a big moving truck a little Honda back there will be forced to follow even if it wants to go else where.
One of my wildest rides in a car, was when my dad desides to tow my mom's broken car back home and we were only 3 hrs away, hit the first hill and the tower wanted to become the towee. 25 years ago and I still get scared

By Adrian (Civicguru) (165.228.11.61) on Tuesday, January 01, 2002 - 03:45 pm:

Why wouldn't you tow it that way??? .... because it's bloody dangerous, that's why!
I don't have a problem towing cars around, I just like to do it reasonable safely that's all.

To even consider it you'd have to have a very solid tow hitch on the car and lock the front wheels dead straight. I have seen a car or two towed this way but they had been set up properly for being towed.

Ryder truck? ... I have absolutley no idea what you are talking about ...

By ddechon (12.91.133.240) on Tuesday, January 01, 2002 - 04:28 pm:

Ryder is a company that rents moving vans in the U.S. The bed is very high off the ground. My wife and I were discussing the move last night. We're not totally sure how were going to do it yet, but I really don't see a problem with a tow bar. The car is very light right now and will be lighter with the spare tire and seats removed. It should be alright. I'm more concerned with being stranded in the middle of nowhere after a breakdown.

Ok Ok! Here's the rest of the story! Yes my yanker is crazy. I'm considering towing my honda with my ford escort. I know it sounds crazy! If my escort doesn't have any passengers or luggage the and my Honda is empty, I shouldn't have a problem. If I get a tow bar, there won't be any hitch weight. The Honda won't have an engine, tranny, gas tank, spare tire, or passenger seats. All that riding on 12 inch tires. It should be as light as a feather. I don't plan on going over 55MPH. The only problem is stopping! ah!

I've got a few other options. Any ideas to how much my honda would weigh after it's empty? If I get a tow dolly it'll almost double the weight of the honda. I calibrate truck scales at work and I'm thinking of barrowing one to check the weight.



Darrell

By electricks (203.62.158.1) on Tuesday, January 01, 2002 - 07:37 pm:

a RWC on my car was done today, mechanic says the left tie rod end is in need of replacing. also, i need to do something with the oil breather on the rocker cover, it's a weber and with no place for the hose to go. do i need a catch can or should i just make it look like the hose goes on the filter somewhere? also, aparently a cv-boot needs replacing (though i'm sure i checked all that stuff to be perfect). how can these be swapped? don't tell me the cv-joint needs to be taken completely apart or something horrible like that.

thanks

By ddechon (12.91.133.101) on Wednesday, January 02, 2002 - 07:28 am:

Roger had discussion about that oil breather (PCV). I think you just need a filter. Origninally it went to the air filter housing for clean air.

I've replaced a few CV boots. There are kits that let you put on the boot without taking off the shaft. However the best boot kit I've seen required me to take apart the shaft. The clamp is important. The best clamp I used had a thin metal strip that was bent backward to create create tightening pressure. Hard to explain. Try not to get greese everywhere or the boot will slip.

By electricks (203.62.158.1) on Wednesday, January 02, 2002 - 09:16 pm:

there was a filter designed to join to the oil cap of old holden engines etc, these had filters built into the oil cap i think. so any filter designed for that would do hey? it was $23 i think.

By dennis singley (65.101.3.187) on Thursday, January 03, 2002 - 05:04 am:

Ideally the condensation chamber hose should run to the airbox so the vacuum of the engine can help scavange the oil vapors. On stock airboxes this was on the outside of the filter. I was able to hook this up on a Weber carb I installed on my wife's old Datsun many moons ago. These Hondas were pre-pcv valves & if the chamber is blocked or hose kinked it will cause oil leaks as the crank pressure gets too high & pushes oil out the weakest gasket. One easy way to read the health of an engine was if you saw oil puddling in the airbox, you could bet it had a lot of blow-by.

By electricks (202.138.23.227) on Sunday, January 06, 2002 - 10:50 pm:

i've made the hose go to the ramflo filter ok, no oil filter other than the air filter which it goes straight onto...

also changed the cv-boot ok. i used an inner boot from another shaft - and found how to take apart the joint... hammer the wheel end of the drive shaft off. once i realised what i was looking at, it came straight off. simple. the boot i was replacing was the el-cheapo that you were talking about, with two joins - one either side of the boot. that was where it was coming apart.

any tips on aligning steering after changing both tie rod ends? - i've gotten it a lot better than it was (excessive toe in) but still a bit iffy. i think i'll take it to a steer shop tomorrow anyway.

thanks for your help all.

By ddechon --Maryland-- (12.91.131.160) on Monday, January 07, 2002 - 02:51 am:

One time I drove down the street for a about a mile. Adjusted the tie rod. Drove down the street. Adjusted the tie rod......

I worked great but I only adjusted one tie rod so I knew which one to adjust.

Darrell

By kelly (152.163.197.204) on Monday, January 07, 2002 - 02:08 pm:

ive heard to count the #of threads exposed before removing the tie rod, this will put you in the ballpark enough to get you to the alignment shop. this is a easy way to get going, but the tires will wear if a shop doesnt align them afterwards.
good luck,
kelly

By electricks (202.138.23.84) on Monday, January 07, 2002 - 05:58 pm:

at the steering shop now... hopefully all goes well with the RWC (they passed a dodgy wheel bearing, but i did change it, but for one in the same condition).